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Drooling Idiot
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 Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:26 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
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"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708154324.522$tV@newsreader.com...
No, because abortion or adoption IS a responsible decision. You seem
to be
equating the RIGHT a woman has to abort a fetus with the RESPONSIBILITY
a man has to take finacial responsibility for the child. Or else you
are equating a woman aborting a child or having it adopted out with
child support payments. Above, I listed SOME of a man's rights. A
woman has those rights, too - to not participate in the child's life,
to participate in the child's life, to use birthcontrol or insist that
the man wear a condom or get herself "fixed" or not have a dick stuck
in her. If a woman isn't responsible enough to either not reproduce or
to take care of her own
offspring, then she shouldn't be a parent (go talk to any CPS working
and you will find that there are plenty of women like that who don't
have their
children, anymore).
So, then are you OK with allowing a man to adopt his kid and make a
responsible decision even if the mother doesn't agree with it and IF the
mother doesn't want the adopt she takes sole responsibility for it.
|
A man doesn't have to adopt his own child. I have no problem with a man
taking responsibility of his child if the mother is unable, unwilling, or
incapable of doing it. I also have no problem with a man trying to get
sole custody of his child even if the mother doesn't want to give up
custody. If the court feels he is a better parent and that the mother is
not able to be a parent then the father SHOULD take custody. I don't think
the father should HAVE to take custody, if he doesn't want to. Nor do I
think that the mother should HAVE to take custody of the child if she
doesn't want to. And the mother should have to pay child support if the
father has primary or sole custody. I ALSO believe that if the mother
doesn't want to have the child adopted out then it shouldn't be, and if the
father doesn't want the child adopted out it shouldn't be. But if the
mother doesn't want the child and the father doesn't want the child adopted
out then he has to take responsibility for the child. |
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Drooling Idiot
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:27 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
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|
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708154324.522$tV@newsreader.com...
No, because abortion or adoption IS a responsible decision. You seem
to be
equating the RIGHT a woman has to abort a fetus with the
RESPONSIBILITY a man has to take finacial responsibility for the
child. Or else you are equating a woman aborting a child or having it
adopted out with child support payments. Above, I listed SOME of a
man's rights. A woman has those rights, too - to not participate in
the child's life, to participate
in the child's life, to use birthcontrol or insist that the man wear a
condom or get herself "fixed" or not have a dick stuck in her. If a
woman
isn't responsible enough to either not reproduce or to take care of
her own
offspring, then she shouldn't be a parent (go talk to any CPS working
and you will find that there are plenty of women like that who don't
have their
children, anymore).
BTW, you ought to look up the terms RIGHTS, the things you mentioned are
not rights,
A man does not have the RIGHT to not participate in a child life as
paying CS is participating in that childs life, he is doing something
that effects the child and is therefore involved in that life.
|
Paying child support is NOT participating in the child's life. Writing a
check is not participation, it is writing a check. Anymore than an
insurance company is "participating" in a child's life when it pays a
medical bill. Don't be a dork! |
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Drooling Idiot
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:29 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162011.009$IG@newsreader.com...
Yes, it is a responsibility, if you can't, or won't, take care of the
child. It is both a right and a responsibility.
It isn't a responsibility , you are confusing terms here and I don't
think by accident. you are just be overally obtuse.
|
Look who is talking. The mother has a responsibility to either ensure that
the child is taken care of by mothering or adopting out the child OR she
needs to terminate the pregnancy. Those ARE responsibilities. |
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Drooling Idiot
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:30 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
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|
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162107.097$B6@newsreader.com...
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708153641.231$xT@newsreader.com...
The scenario above says: "She can even do this if the father knows
of the child and since father rarely can get physical control of the
child it makes it virtually impossible for him to do so and in some
areas it simply isn't allowed." No, custody isn't a slam dunk, but
if the mother is trying
to have the child adopted out (as the above scenario says) then the
court is not going to just simply say "you're the father, you have
no say". If the child wants the child and is able to care for it he
WILL get it. But if the father just wants the child to stay with
the mother so he has some connection to her the court is probably
not going to allow that.
You ought to do some reading then and look up case law. There are a
number of jurisdictions where there is no requirement to notify the
father before proceeding with an adoption and courts do in fact say
"you have no say".
You should do some reading, too (and not cut my posts). My FIRST
question was WHERE DO YOU LIVE?
It doesn't matter where I live, Canada does allow children to be put up
for adoption without fathers consent, so does several US states.
|
Name one US state that allows this. |
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Ranting
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:30 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162614.851$sN@newsreader.com...
| Quote: |
So, then are you OK with allowing a man to adopt his kid and make a
responsible decision even if the mother doesn't agree with it and IF the
mother doesn't want the adopt she takes sole responsibility for it.
A man doesn't have to adopt his own child.
|
OOPS, I mistyped that question, it should have read
So, then you are OK with allowing a man to adopt OUT his own child, iow, put
his child up for adoption without the mothers consent |
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Ranting
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:32 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162759.245$GF@newsreader.com...
| Quote: |
BTW, you ought to look up the terms RIGHTS, the things you mentioned are
not rights,
A man does not have the RIGHT to not participate in a child life as
paying CS is participating in that childs life, he is doing something
that effects the child and is therefore involved in that life.
Paying child support is NOT participating in the child's life. Writing a
check is not participation, it is writing a check. Anymore than an
insurance company is "participating" in a child's life when it pays a
medical bill. Don't be a dork!
|
It is participating in a childs life.
It is so funny with people like you who want to give all the rights (please
look up the term before responding) to one party and only responsibilities
to another party. |
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Ranting
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:33 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
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"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162935.553$r6@newsreader.com...
| Quote: |
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162011.009$IG@newsreader.com...
Yes, it is a responsibility, if you can't, or won't, take care of the
child. It is both a right and a responsibility.
It isn't a responsibility , you are confusing terms here and I don't
think by accident. you are just be overally obtuse.
Look who is talking. The mother has a responsibility to either ensure
that
the child is taken care of by mothering or adopting out the child OR she
needs to terminate the pregnancy. Those ARE responsibilities.
|
SO then, should have a man have the right to adopt out his child thereby
making a responsible decision or should he just be force to pay for it
himself. |
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Ranting
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:36 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708163007.422$Gv@newsreader.com...
| Quote: |
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162107.097$B6@newsreader.com...
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708153641.231$xT@newsreader.com...
The scenario above says: "She can even do this if the father knows
of the child and since father rarely can get physical control of the
child it makes it virtually impossible for him to do so and in some
areas it simply isn't allowed." No, custody isn't a slam dunk, but
if the mother is trying
to have the child adopted out (as the above scenario says) then the
court is not going to just simply say "you're the father, you have
no say". If the child wants the child and is able to care for it he
WILL get it. But if the father just wants the child to stay with
the mother so he has some connection to her the court is probably
not going to allow that.
You ought to do some reading then and look up case law. There are a
number of jurisdictions where there is no requirement to notify the
father before proceeding with an adoption and courts do in fact say
"you have no say".
You should do some reading, too (and not cut my posts). My FIRST
question was WHERE DO YOU LIVE?
It doesn't matter where I live, Canada does allow children to be put up
for adoption without fathers consent, so does several US states.
Name one US state that allows this.
|
In most U.S. States with safe haven laws, a parent may surrender the baby to
a safe haven. In four States (Georgia, Maryland, Minnesota, and
Tennessee),only the mother may relinquish the infant
In those states a father can not use the safe haven laws. And so that you
don't be overelly obtuse again, safe haven laws usually end up with the baby
being adopted. |
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Ranting
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:39 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708163007.422$Gv@newsreader.com...
| Quote: |
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162107.097$B6@newsreader.com...
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708153641.231$xT@newsreader.com...
The scenario above says: "She can even do this if the father knows
of the child and since father rarely can get physical control of the
child it makes it virtually impossible for him to do so and in some
areas it simply isn't allowed." No, custody isn't a slam dunk, but
if the mother is trying
to have the child adopted out (as the above scenario says) then the
court is not going to just simply say "you're the father, you have
no say". If the child wants the child and is able to care for it he
WILL get it. But if the father just wants the child to stay with
the mother so he has some connection to her the court is probably
not going to allow that.
You ought to do some reading then and look up case law. There are a
number of jurisdictions where there is no requirement to notify the
father before proceeding with an adoption and courts do in fact say
"you have no say".
You should do some reading, too (and not cut my posts). My FIRST
question was WHERE DO YOU LIVE?
It doesn't matter where I live, Canada does allow children to be put up
for adoption without fathers consent, so does several US states.
Name one US state that allows this.
|
Also, in reality mothers who use safe haven laws can and do completely cut
out the father because it is virtually impossible to find the father as the
mother isn't required to give indentifying info, where as with a father
using the safe haven laws, the agencies can find the mother thru hospital
records etc, but those same records rarely have the fathers info. |
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Drooling Idiot
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:42 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162614.851$sN@newsreader.com...
So, then are you OK with allowing a man to adopt his kid and make a
responsible decision even if the mother doesn't agree with it and IF
the mother doesn't want the adopt she takes sole responsibility for
it.
A man doesn't have to adopt his own child.
OOPS, I mistyped that question, it should have read
So, then you are OK with allowing a man to adopt OUT his own child, iow,
put his child up for adoption without the mothers consent
|
No, as I already stated, I am not OK with a mother adopting out a child
without the father's consent and I am not OK with a father adopting out a
child without the mother's consent. BUT if the father or mother don't want
the adoption to take place then THEY needto take responsibility for the
child. |
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Drooling Idiot
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:45 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162759.245$GF@newsreader.com...
BTW, you ought to look up the terms RIGHTS, the things you mentioned
are not rights,
A man does not have the RIGHT to not participate in a child life as
paying CS is participating in that childs life, he is doing something
that effects the child and is therefore involved in that life.
Paying child support is NOT participating in the child's life. Writing
a check is not participation, it is writing a check. Anymore than an
insurance company is "participating" in a child's life when it pays a
medical bill. Don't be a dork!
It is participating in a childs life.
It is so funny with people like you who want to give all the rights
(please look up the term before responding) to one party and only
responsibilities to another party.
|
You are SO narrow minded. No doubt you vote republican if you live in the
USA. You probably call anyone who disagrees with you "traitor" or
"pedophile" or "communist" or whatever other phrase you can use to demonize
them. |
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Ranting
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:47 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708164302.027$ph@newsreader.com...
| Quote: |
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162614.851$sN@newsreader.com...
So, then are you OK with allowing a man to adopt his kid and make a
responsible decision even if the mother doesn't agree with it and IF
the mother doesn't want the adopt she takes sole responsibility for
it.
A man doesn't have to adopt his own child.
OOPS, I mistyped that question, it should have read
So, then you are OK with allowing a man to adopt OUT his own child, iow,
put his child up for adoption without the mothers consent
No, as I already stated, I am not OK with a mother adopting out a child
without the father's consent and I am not OK with a father adopting out a
child without the mother's consent. BUT if the father or mother don't
want
the adoption to take place then THEY needto take responsibility for the
child.
|
OK, now you have me confused becuase you just contradicted yourself.
Here is a scenario
Father wants to adopt out the child , mother says NO , so then, if the
mother says NO< do you believe that the father is responsible for CS. |
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Drooling Idiot
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:48 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162935.553$r6@newsreader.com...
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162011.009$IG@newsreader.com...
Yes, it is a responsibility, if you can't, or won't, take care of
the child. It is both a right and a responsibility.
It isn't a responsibility , you are confusing terms here and I don't
think by accident. you are just be overally obtuse.
Look who is talking. The mother has a responsibility to either ensure
that
the child is taken care of by mothering or adopting out the child OR
she needs to terminate the pregnancy. Those ARE responsibilities.
SO then, should have a man have the right to adopt out his child thereby
making a responsible decision or should he just be force to pay for it
himself.
|
I say make the fucker pay. Hell, sell everything he owns and then toss his
ass in jail. And while we are at it I say sell his organs and give that
money to the mother, too! AND make him work while he is in prison, so that
he can continue to pay for his offspring. It won't matter what I say, THAT
is what you will hear. |
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Ranting
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:48 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708164506.008$dv@newsreader.com...
| Quote: |
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162759.245$GF@newsreader.com...
BTW, you ought to look up the terms RIGHTS, the things you mentioned
are not rights,
A man does not have the RIGHT to not participate in a child life as
paying CS is participating in that childs life, he is doing something
that effects the child and is therefore involved in that life.
Paying child support is NOT participating in the child's life. Writing
a check is not participation, it is writing a check. Anymore than an
insurance company is "participating" in a child's life when it pays a
medical bill. Don't be a dork!
It is participating in a childs life.
It is so funny with people like you who want to give all the rights
(please look up the term before responding) to one party and only
responsibilities to another party.
You are SO narrow minded. No doubt you vote republican if you live in the
USA. You probably call anyone who disagrees with you "traitor" or
"pedophile" or "communist" or whatever other phrase you can use to
demonize
them.
|
Wow, have a look in the mirror, you want to give women all the right and
some responsibilities but MEN only responsibilities. |
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Drooling Idiot
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 1:49 am Post subject: Re: Abortions: Should the father have some say? |
|
|
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708163007.422$Gv@newsreader.com...
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708162107.097$B6@newsreader.com...
"Ranting" <rant@rant.com> wrote:
"Drooling Idiot" <droolingidiot@live.com> wrote in message
news:20080708153641.231$xT@newsreader.com...
The scenario above says: "She can even do this if the father
knows of the child and since father rarely can get physical
control of the child it makes it virtually impossible for him to
do so and in some areas it simply isn't allowed." No, custody
isn't a slam dunk, but if the mother is trying
to have the child adopted out (as the above scenario says) then
the court is not going to just simply say "you're the father, you
have no say". If the child wants the child and is able to care
for it he WILL get it. But if the father just wants the child to
stay with the mother so he has some connection to her the court
is probably not going to allow that.
You ought to do some reading then and look up case law. There are a
number of jurisdictions where there is no requirement to notify the
father before proceeding with an adoption and courts do in fact say
"you have no say".
You should do some reading, too (and not cut my posts). My FIRST
question was WHERE DO YOU LIVE?
It doesn't matter where I live, Canada does allow children to be put
up for adoption without fathers consent, so does several US states.
Name one US state that allows this.
In most U.S. States with safe haven laws, a parent may surrender the baby
to a safe haven. In four States (Georgia, Maryland, Minnesota, and
Tennessee),only the mother may relinquish the infant
In those states a father can not use the safe haven laws. And so that you
don't be overelly obtuse again, safe haven laws usually end up with the
baby being adopted.
|
This has NOTHING to do with what we are talking about. You said that there
are states that allow the mother to adopt out the child, on her own, even
though the court knows who the father is. |
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